Irony Pony teamwork community

044: Defying the Odds Through Teamwork & Community with Chris Jones

Apr 22, 2021

Iron Pony is one of the largest motorcycle dealerships in the Midwest. They grew from a NAPA auto parts store into a thriving business selling parts, apparel, accessories, vehicles, and more. The company has never stopped evolving, and this proved true again in 2020, when they didn’t just survive, but thrived, over the course of the COVID-19 pandemic.

In this episode, Chris Jones joins the podcast to tell the story of how he went from dreaming of owning a business to becoming an entrepreneur, the value of honesty and transparency in everything you do, and how teamwork and community empowered the business to be busier than ever when they reopened.

Here are just a handful of the things that we'll discuss:

  • How Chris paid his dues and took Iron Pony from a NAPA auto parts store into one of the largest dealerships in the Midwest.
  • The value of bringing in and retaining great talent to fill in your gaps as an entrepreneur.
  • Why Chris never wanted to sell new motorcycles–and how he ended up innovating in his industry when he ultimately became a dealer.
  • The one major mistake Chris made as the pandemic hit, and how he fixed it.
  • How Chris is working to maintain work-life balance in uncertain times.

Interview Resources


LeAnne Siddell: It’s The Retirement Trainer with Ed Siddell, a podcast about finding ways to help you become financially fit for your future no matter what financial shape you’re in now. 2020 was a challenging year for a lot of people, and in particular, small businesses. EGSI Financial believes in giving back to the community that has supported us for nearly 20 years. And as part of that, we’re starting a campaign called Giving Back to Small Businesses.


What we’re going to do is highlight two small businesses every month on our podcast, Ed Siddell The Retirement Trainer, which is on iHeartRadio, Spotify, Apple Play, and everywhere you listen to podcasts to learn about these small businesses, what kept them going and succeeding during COVID-19. Our goal is to promote and learn the lessons of these small businesses so other business owners can draw upon their experiences and lessons to enhance their own situation.


Today, we have Chris Jones joining us on our podcast. He’s the founder and president of Iron Pony right here in Columbus, Ohio. I’m LeAnne Siddell, and here to help us with all our questions and to give us some guidance to help us stay in the best financial shape possible, The Retirement Trainer, Ed Siddell. Hi, Ed. Hi, Chris.


Ed Siddell: Hey, LeAnne, good morning. How are you? Chris, welcome.


Chris Jones: Good morning.


LeAnne Siddell: Welcome, welcome. Thank you.


Ed Siddell: Yeah. Thanks for joining us. I appreciate it.


Chris Jones: Certainly.


Ed Siddell: Well, you know, really, the reason we wanted to have you on the show is you guys really came out of last year doing really well. And the whole purpose of this podcast, this series is for people to learn from people like yourself in businesses, what you did, how you did it, but more importantly, what got you into this business? I mean, Iron Pony is a huge, huge motorcycle dealership, one of the largest, if not the largest in the Midwest and in the country. So, tell us, how did you even start getting into motorcycles?


LeAnne Siddell: It’s not just motorcycles.


Chris Jones: Yeah, motorcycles were a later addition. Actually, the way it started, and it’s kind of interesting, my father and two partners had a number of NAPA job or auto parts stores around Columbus. And Iron Pony was just a small offshoot in a couple of their NAPA locations that were selling motorcycle parts, and even at that time, van accessories. And as a young man following my father around to the stores, I had to do things like mow the grass and take out the trash and all those types of things, but the motorcycle side was just so much cooler than the old-style auto parts stores that my dad and his partners had. The Iron Pony side had apparel helmets, to me, a lot more exciting, motorcycles pulling up.


And unfortunately, as some larger auto parts stores moved into Columbus, and of course, there’s huge chains for those now that there weren’t back then, the auto parts stores went by the wayside, but I just kind of kept Iron Pony going in his last NAPA location after it closed. And as a sort of college, I would go down and just open Iron Pony. My schedule for my class is before noon and I go try to open it from noon until whenever we could deal with customers. So, that’s kind of how it got going. And I always hoped it would grow large, but, boy, for a lot of years, it was sure a small thing.


Ed Siddell: So, I mean, this has really been your life’s work. I mean, ever since you were paying your dues, if you will, right?


Chris Jones: Absolutely. I think one of the nicest things I ever heard is that at one of the Iron Pony Christmas parties a few years ago, one of my first bosses, Alan Schatz, he is now our general manager, he told the story to everybody at the Christmas party that he never forgot many, many years ago, went on across the street in our original location that I used to look over at the same market building that we’re now in, and I said, one day, I’m going to own that building. We’re going to put Iron Pony over there.


Ed Siddell: Wow.


Chris Jones: He goes, “I thought he was the craziest kid. Just look at what happened now.” So, it was just really, really heartwarming. And it’s kind of neat that he remembered that, so.


Ed Siddell: That’s pretty awesome. That’s pretty awesome. And you and Tammy, so Tammy is your life partner, business partner as well, and forgive me for saying this, at least your better half, if not more, right?


Chris Jones: That’s when she came into my life at a perfect time, and my ability was more on the sales end, and she brought a lot of structure and design, and ultimately, some accounting acumen. And then, one of our first employees, when he was young at 14, Cory, who is now our CFO, he brought even more accounting acumen to the business, and it’s been a perfect match. Those two really pick up– or have strengths where some of my weaknesses are, it’s been a great combination.


Ed Siddell: Wow. So, Cory has been there since he was 14 years old.


Chris Jones: Absolutely. He started when he was 14. And I hate saying that he did the same things I did. I think his first job when he came in was cleaning the restaurant, they trash out. And we look back and we laugh about it. And he kind of left us for a couple of years when he got his accounting degree at Ohio State, and he went on and worked for a title agency here in town. And we weren’t big enough to really bring him back at the time, and when we finally said, “Okay, we’re going to grow this thing.” He was the first person I went to, and thank God he joined us. And it’s just been perfect as he is such a wonderful motorcycle rider off road, on road. He’d probably, actually been a racer if he wasn’t so good at accounting.


And then, when he came back to join us, things really took off, or I like to say and tell people the story that Tammy and Cory take kind of my crazy growth ideas in our industry and explain them to the bank.


LeAnne Siddell: That’s great.


Ed Siddell: And that’s probably one of the coolest things, having been around you guys over the last couple of years, the culture that you have there, the longevity of the employees like yourself, like Cory, and just there’s example after example after example. And I really think that that probably plays a huge, huge part in your success, but that’s a big credit to you and Tammy as well, because people don’t stick around if you’re not taking care of them and having…


LeAnne Siddell: They don’t feel valued, yeah.


Ed Siddell: Yeah, that’s exactly it. So, how did you…


Chris Jones: So, I agree.


Ed Siddell: So, how did you go from where you were to expanding in becoming the size that you are today?


Chris Jones: Well, when I met Tammy, actually, she joined Iron Pony, we kind of got it going and started doing fairly well. Then, the first Iraq war kind of hit, but once we got things going well, then all of a sudden at the time, my father wanted back in, and that created some internal– I think, any family business had done. For a couple of years, Tammy and I actually went out on the road and became sales reps for a couple of industry distributors and industry manufacturers and actually did very well. It took a couple of years to get going because everybody was afraid that we had Iron Pony background and that somehow, we were trying to do that, but we met so many wonderful people in the industry, many people that now own or run distributors and manufacturers, but one thing that we really learned traveling around the country is that no one was focusing on what Iron Pony was focusing on, which was the parts and apparel and accessories.


Almost all the dealers even wanted large ones that were in big buildings and who hadn’t a lot going on, they were focused on just selling units. And it amazed us because we worked for so many apparel companies when we were these independent reps, and you would literally walk in stores with Xerox of your products and sell them to customers that were coming in these dealers. And then, the dealer would get mad at you, you’d ask, “Hey, can I sell it to the guy? I’ll let you make 40%.” They’d say, “Yes,” and then they wouldn’t pay you, and then they still wouldn’t want to order any of the stuff. And Tammy and I, it’s not that I think we’re both very smart, but we just saw that opportunity. We were like, wow, right there is what we need to do. And we got kind of lucky, we had two small Iron Pony stores in Columbus. We had the one at Westerville Road and 161, and we had one down at Eakin in Harrisburg Pike.


And it’s just because of luck, Walgreens, who was going around Columbus in all these corners, our store down there was like a third property in from a corner, and they didn’t want us initially and it ended up that because of some variances and right of ways that they ended up needing our property. And so, we owned some of that along with my father, and that kind of gave us the money to jump to a middle-sized store. And from the day we did that and put the inventory in it, we took all. So, we did everything that we thought it would, and then some, so.


Ed Siddell: Wow. I mean, that’s awesome. And it just seems like you guys just keep evolving, as things change, your offerings, your breadth of services, as well as products, it just keeps growing.


LeAnne Siddell: And it’s also the ability for you guys to see where those holes are. I think that’s the truest example of an entrepreneur, is to see not just where you have weaknesses and you need people to fill in those, but to see where the business is lacking and where you see opportunity.


Chris Jones: Yeah, absolutely. And we swore it was kind of interesting, people don’t believe that when we purchased this Kmart facility, we didn’t work selling motorcycles. It was all parts, apparel and accessories for a store this large, and the only way that we got– and people will tell you this, I said, I will never, never sell new motorcycles. I didn’t want to and just was kind of against it. And when the housing bubble hit in 2006, 2007, maybe even in early 2008, a lot of the dealerships around Columbus that were not well run and probably, I never try to grow my business or someone else’s, but probably, we had absorbed a lot of their sports apparel accessory business. They were all hurting and started kind of going out of business one after another. And we bought one, and we didn’t even have our dealer license yet on it.


And the next one, it down the road went out of business, and one thing led to another. And pretty much over the last 12 years, I think, every year we’ve added at least one, if not two new OEMs to the business. And then, we had to add on to a Kmart store. Who would have ever guessed that? And we were probably out of place, again now, but it was timing. And like you both said, it was looking for the opportunity that existed. We watched how other dealers in the motorcycle industry did business and we said, “Hey, if we ever do this, we want to do it differently.” And I think we’ve done a good job of doing it differently. And now, we’re starting to see other dealers around the state starting to imitate some of the things that we did, which is not charging outlandish extra fees for buying motorcycles and things like that. So, I think we force some other dealers, at least in our market area to, I hate to say adapt their game, but at least change because we were continuing to read ideas and things like this that kind of was forcing them to follow now.


LeAnne Siddell: One thing I know about you and Tammy, just that you’re genuine to the nth degree, and I do think that comes through in the way you run your business. So, I want to just…


Ed Siddell: And your whole team.


LeAnne Siddell: Yeah. I really want to focus on the fact that it’s not just about the ability to change, I guess, I want to kind of focus a little bit on, you said, you changed the way that you sold motorcycles or that motorcycle dealers dealt with business. We’re seeing that happen in the car industry, but specifically, just being honest, transparent, and just very basic in the way that you sell to people, they appreciate it.


Chris Jones: Absolutely. I think that the thing that we’ve done in the motorcycle industry, that it sounds crazy if you’re looking at it from a larger industry or you work for larger employers, we instituted things like health insurance and vision insurance and dental insurance and 401(k)s decades ago. And some of our employees, like you mentioned, have been with us 20 or 25 or 30 years now, they got in our 401(k) either early, and how well they’re doing there in an industry that they love, but in the motorcycle industry, there are still very few players.


I can’t tell you how many times we go to interview someone that’s been at another dealership. And when we start talking about health care and 401, you can kind of see that huh? And it’s like, no, this is a real business, and we have real time-off, we have real benefits. And the idea is it’s something that you like to do. I think all of us, I hope most people would get back to doing a job that they love. I know maybe some of the younger crowd, I think, the term is chasing paper, or they always follow the money. If you find a job that you like in an industry that you like and you’re putting money away for your retirement and you’ve got good health care, you’ve got a good number of days off, and someone like Tammy and I and Cory obviously, that we treat everyone like family, like 100%…


Ed Siddell: Oh, absolutely.


Chris Jones: And we’re always here, we always will help out in ways that the company can, and I think that shows through. Like I was looking the other day, we’d had a couple employees that are over 30 years now with us. We’ve got a bunch of 25 and a bunch over 20 and a ton over 10. So, in the motorcycle industry, that’s not normal.


Ed Siddell: Actually, in any industry.


Chris Jones: Yeah. Well, I guess. When I was a road rep, I was trained by a gentleman that I worked for at a really neat company in Rhode Island back in the day. And he said, “Hey, when you go into a motorcycle dealership, meet the parts manager, definitely meet the assistant parts manager, but also meet the person cleaning the floor.” And I said, “Why is that?” And he goes, “because when winter hits, they get rid of the parts manager because he’s making too much. They hire the assistant, and then they bring the floor guy up to be the assistant.” And I cannot tell you how many times that held true.


And that’s when Tammy and I, after a year or two, started doing really well when we were independent reps because all those people that we took the time to show product to, when they did become the parts manager of a dealership, they remembered that we cared. And I think the respect, especially for the older team members that have been with us a long time, they know that Tammy and I have done every job, including cleaning the restrooms, including answering the phones, including running deposits to the bank, including staying late for that customer that can’t be in for an hour and a half have closed, they know that we did that. And it’s very fulfilling when you hear one of them tell one of our newer team members, “Hey, you don’t understand. Watch out, Tammy is going to be down here, you’re going to have a hard time keeping up.”


Ed Siddell: And again, it goes to that team culture. And I think that had a lot to do with how you guys were able to deal with last year, because I remember talking with you, I think, it was towards the end of April, and that’s when things were crazy, April 2020, no one really knew what was going on. So, how did you deal with that? How did you guys kind of not just survive, but kind of really make it happen and take care of everyone on your team? How did you guys do that?


Chris Jones: And I remember that phone call, and you were right, I was definitely very nervous. It’s probably an understatement for what was going on.


Ed Siddell: Yeah.


Chris Jones: The timing of the COVID last year, pandemic couldn’t have been worse for us because we are still somewhat of a seasonal business. So, we were just coming out of many winter months, little to a year not strong cash flow, and we had staff that were hired in the event. That late January went well, we had brought on probably another 20 or 25 people that we were now training at a loss. We had millions and millions of dollars’ worth of the parts and accessory inventory that had come in. A large distributor had gone bankrupt the summer before, and we bought the majority of their inventory. So, we had, I don’t know, 350 skids of merchandise that just hit the door and millions of dollars’ worth of motorcycles, of course, gearing up for the spring, and then boom, we were closed down.


And the one mistake that we made, and we’ve corrected it now, is that we didn’t have a centralized employee portal for information. And then, the problem is, like you said, nobody really knew what was going to go on. And after a couple of weeks of being mostly closed down, we did get our service department back geared up because they were considered essential, and we got back our main mechanics and a couple of our service riders and got that kind of going, and then we brought in a couple of parts people and we were doing curbside pickup for parts and we started selling bikes again by appointment. And we could see by the demand for the bikes by appointment that we felt that we could get back up, and things were going to be pretty good.


And so, we kind of stocked, of course, and we got lucky. We were right on that edge of, are we completely essential or not? We got okay that we were, but then we had to do some things within our store. We had to create some wider aisles to make sure we had appropriate social distancing, and back then, of course, trying to find enough sanitizer. The masks and the plexiglass and all those things were really, really tough. And the PPP, we did do a PPP early, it was absolutely perfect for what Iron Pony needed to get back on its feet because it gave us that initial push and some cash flow to get out and buy what ended up being thousands and thousands of dollars’ worth of plexiglass and having some of our facilities people build that plexiglass on the counters, and they’ll get all the floor marked for social distancing, finding masks because we wanted to give away masks. Back then, trying to find them was…


Ed Siddell: Yeah, impossible.


Chris Jones: Get enough hand sanitizer, yeah, it was crazy. I mean, I remember paying $60 to $80 just for a gallon of hand sanitizer that you’re going through. And we had to create all kinds of new protocols. At the time, we had to clean every single shopping cart. Yes, we have shopping carts at a motorcycle dealership which people can’t believe, but we have plenty of them. And how do we get each one of those done? We had to work with our facilities people to make sure bathrooms and high-touch surfaces, all the things that the CDC originally did. And so, we really weren’t sure what was going to happen, but we did get back up on day first. And I tell you, from the second we opened back up, it was unbelievable. And our team, we had so many of our employees that just wanted to come to work for free while we were shut down.


LeAnne Siddell: Wow.


Chris Jones: We basically had to tell them to go home. Well, they were like we don’t care, we just want to be here to help. And I can’t wait, I certainly hope that this year, we can have an Iron Pony Christmas party, like we normally do because I’m going to take some of those people that went out of the way like that. We’re going to make sure they get even more rewarded for what they did. And we did it like for, what, so many top employers around, we basically kind of instituted a hero pay for everybody, hourly salaried employees once we saw how we were doing and how well we were doing. It was amazing, but our industry, like so many, we had huge supply chain issues. I think one of the things that really helped us through that we had so much inventory here front loaded that we were able to do it, but our team here and our community supported us. We got what we could have ever imagined.


Ed Siddell: So, I mean, how has your marketing changed? Because I know marketing has always been big for you guys, I remember the TV commercial from years ago, which I just…


Chris Jones: The thing that’s hillbilly.


Ed Siddell: Yeah, I loved it. I loved it, of course, because I’m a hillbilly so it warmed my heart.


Chris Jones: That was actually– it was so funny. And still to this day, I think those TV ads really, really were one of the things that really helped us grow. That was kind of a crazy idea that I had, because we’re like, how do we differentiate Iron Pony from a dealer? And so, the concept kind of came up for a– it would set up, we took some old calendars from our old original store in the back of our middle store and made kind of a crappy-looking motorcycle dealership, which still something in our market area may or may not be.


And we hired a professional actor, we had a local media company come in, and the idea was this guy was bringing in a magazine and he’s like, “Hey, I just bought my bike here last week. I’m looking for this helmet.” And the parts person would say, “I don’t have those, Iron Pony might have them.” It’s kind of a cliché, I guess, the dealership that doesn’t stock helmets. And we filmed it a couple of times with some professional actors, and it kind of went okay. At the time, we had this good customer that was friends with a gentleman that worked with us, and we said, “Hey, hillbilly, get in there and do a take of that.” And you know what? The parts guy, he was like, “We ain’t got them, Iron Pony might got them.” We all fell out of our chair. 


Ed Siddell: It was awesome.


Chris Jones: Yeah, He went on to– we did all kinds of them with a joke that actually shortly thereafter, came on as our facilities manager for quite a few years. And he’s still a good friend of the company. And we still kidded about doing those spots, but what we really did in the early years is we did some radio, but I really felt that the cable TV, insertion TV ads, and the things that are demographic were one of the things that really, really helped us grow initially, but in the last couple of years, we’ve really moved to almost all digital now. We still do some TV insertion. If there’s a motorcycle race or an outdoor type show, you’ll still see some of our TV insertion stuff, but with digital marketing, we can hit so many different people, now that we have 20 different brands between our two locations. Each one of them has digital assets, and it’s important that we take advantage of almost all of those types of things.


And I hate saying it, really, since we’ve opened back up, we’re really probably busier than the business that we can handle. And I hate saying that because I always want to be able to do more with the amount of phone calls and the amount of floor traffic that we have. And we sought to be careful because we’re still under some guidelines for a number of people on our floor. We can’t really do a whole lot more than we are looking at our phone bank, a number of phone calls, it’d be impossible to answer any more, and I’m probably not doing as good a job as we should be right now, just doing so with– it’s been amazing since we opened back up. It’s busier than we could have ever imagined. And we’re lucky to be successful through this pandemic because I know there’s a lot of businesses that haven’t been there as well. And we’re continuing to try to think– the hardest thing is we want to reward all of our team, but because we can’t get them all together to do…


Ed Siddell: Makes it tough, yep.


Chris Jones: Go to and makes it tough. So, we’re doing a lot of things, like buying watches or trying to get groups where we’re allowed off to ride, and again, trying to do some hero pays. What we’re trying to do is make fun things. We’ve kind of engaged our marketing team to come up almost every month with a new– one of our competitors thought it was a good idea to put a billboard across from our building, and so, we did an internal fun thing, let’s approved their billboard, and the team efforts really got behind it and that worked out really well. When we had a big snow pile out front, they will be fully melted and win some money. And so, trying to get as much engagement as we can, that’s what’s really tough, is that we can’t get the whole team or large groups of the team together to do bowling nights and golf nights and things like that, that we would normally do.


LeAnne Siddell: Yep, the team bonding stuff is huge, so yeah.


Ed Siddell: And as busy as you guys have been over the last year, and you and Tammy building this from the ground up from where you started to where it’s at now, I mean, what have you guys done, you and Tammy, to really create that work-life balance, because it’s hard to do as an entrepreneur or business owners?


LeAnne Siddell: And especially, you just sitting there talking about the fact that you have more business than– I imagine that means that you guys are staying late a lot.


Chris Jones: We’re much better, but that’s all I can say is Tammy and I and Cory still and probably now my son and a lot of our team, I wouldn’t say we probably work too much, I guarantee you we worked too much for almost all of our business life. The big change for Tammy and I came about four years ago. We, through a mutual friend, found a cabin down at Hideaway Hills, Ohio, and we discovered a number of people down there that we like to socialize with. They have a little golf course, five fishing lakes, and the best part of all of it is they’ve got 31 miles of private roads that you’re allowed to ride your ATVs.


Ed Siddell: Hey, let’s not promote that. We’re looking down there. Wait until we buy a place.


Chris Jones: Well, that’s how I kind of found it. We came in, we were like, “Hey, we’ve got to find something to get out of the business.” And we were looking for a small cabin with maybe some acreage. And through a friend, one of the big realtors out of Hideaway Hills kept saying, “Hey, brother, come down and check out my cabin.” And we did one night, we kind of fell in love with the place. And it’s funny now, outside, IT people came down one time, he’s got a cabin down there, or one of our corporate council came down there one time, he’s got a cabin down there. Yeah, I don’t want that to get now, but that’s really changed our lives tremendously because we do find that we’re making time now to get away from the business and get down there.


And what we find is after we’ve been down there for a couple of days and we come back, I think we’re probably more energized, although we probably drive everybody nutes, when we get back, because we go down and think of all kinds of ideas and come back and want to implement them right away, but that’s either way, for a long time, we probably didn’t have as good a life balance as both of our children really grew up inside of the business and we probably focused too much time, but what we did growing up with our kids, we went to industry events or things like that, it was appropriate for kids to go, they went with us. So, we turned, say a trade show for a supplier that maybe was in Fort Lauderdale or something, we were going to stay a couple extra days with our kids and try to do as much stuff like that, but this business really is our life, was our life.


And again, it’s a reward effort. Some of our top managers tell other people, hey, you don’t realize how many seven days a week for, jeez, from the time I was 18 to probably 40, seven days a week and I had to do all the purchasing, all the receiving, all the marketing plus have to work all the hours that we were open. And every time we were going to do an event, we had to load up the trailer and go do so many of those types of things. People have been here a long time, they definitely remember, but we are putting in less hours now and have turned over more day-to-day operations to Cory and our top managers.


LeAnne Siddell: Well, that’s kind of why I think having that family environment at the office where you can depend on people where you know that you can leave…


Ed Siddell: Yeah, they’ve got your back.


LeAnne Siddell: And they’re going to care for it, like you were there. So, I think that’s a testament to what you guys have built. So, again, I really appreciate the time today, Chris, because I do think we all gain little pieces of information from your successes, as well as some of the downtimes to learn how to be prepared if something like this were to happen again or something similar. So, again, we’re going to… I’m sorry, go ahead.


Ed Siddell: No, I was just going to say, and Chris, yeah, we really do appreciate it. And how can people learn more about you guys? Where are you guys located? How can they find you?


Chris Jones: Well, the easiest way is probably The main store, our large store is at Westerville Road and 161, just south of Westerville in Northeast Columbus. And we also have a smaller dealership up on Ashland Road in Mansfield, but will get you to all the different things going on. And our main store is open seven days a week, and we sell all the brands where if you’ve got a motorcycle or think about getting a motorcycle or an ATV or side by side, call us.


Ed Siddell: Awesome.


LeAnne Siddell: Awesome. We’re going to have you all linked up also to our podcast, but if you know of a small business in the Columbus area that we should learn a little bit more about how they overcame this last difficult year, please let us know. Ed is always saying when difficult times hit, it’s important to have a plan. We build plans for our clients to help avoid the anxiety of what comes next when bad things happen. And as we know, sometimes those bad things do happen. 2020 is an example of how we have watched businesses put these plans in place and follow them through and through.


So, anyway, small businesses need a plan and need to prepare for the unknowns. We’re looking to support and grow and learn more about these small businesses who made it through 2020. So, if you have a small business success story, please give us a call at (614) 526-4118, or email us at You can also go ahead and find out more about us on our website, which is Thanks so much, Chris, for this time. I really appreciate it. Thanks, Ed.


Ed Siddell: Yep. Thanks, Chris. I appreciate it.


Chris Jones: Absolutely.




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